Israel

MolOverBeethoven

So did I, if you'd read my post. They also took my grandfather away from me. My entire point was everyone suffers, no-one wins.

MolOverBeethoven

Travis_Bickle

I know, I know. But it remains the root cause of all of it. What's to be done? Smarter men than me don't know and I certainly don't.

cordshoes

Travis_Bickle my issue isn't the existence of Israel and the related religious issue.
It's the behaviour of that country in the 75 years since it was created.
And given the undoubted significance of the Holocaust, their actions are even more deplorable and less understandable.

Travis_Bickle

cordshoes what about the conduct of its neighbours? Or the Palestinians themselves? Are they to be judged by the same standard?

Misura

Travis_Bickle As I mentioned above, you obviously know your onions about the topic & have an interest in it, I'd be interested to know you view of a viable solution? Or even your view of a ideal solution.

A viable Palestinian state gets created? A self governed, but non sovereign state gets created? That the Palestinians surrender any idea of a country and Gaza and West Bank get amalgamated into Israel? That the UN gives the Palestinians £100k to relocate to Egypt/Syria/Jordan? Things remain the same but with more Israeli control over Gaza?

hendersonjones

https://amp.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/oct/14/australia-rejects-proposal-to-recognise-aboriginal-people-in-constitution
Worlds fucked

MolOverBeethoven

hendersonjones

Yeah. Every state voted no. Every single state.

Is anyone surprised though? I wasn't. New PM in NZ too, talking about taking away Maori rights. Got elected on a platform of binning the Maori Health Authority.

Travis_Bickle

Misura a 2-state solution is the only solution. Getting there seems almost impossible at the moment. But that can change.
It needs a progressive regime in Israel and some major shifts on the Palestinian side.
It needs Israel being prepared to 'return' land and take on the militant settlers.
And it needs the Palestinians to stop regarding this as a religious war.
The real issue would be the military and security aspects of any new Palestinian, self-governing state (see above about Netanyahu's unworkable model).

Travis_Bickle

And people were angry about flags.
Two Jewish friends' children have left this country in recent years for Israel. You can see why.
From the river to the sea. And in parks, shops, buses, schools and in homes too it seems.

Raposa

Travis_Bickle
Be interesting to see if Sunak and his cronies enforce some kind of retrospective action against that cunt i.e. incitement just for starters.

Placid

Israel absolutely let this happen. To totally level Gaza strip and make the population leave.

90Piesanhour

It's one way to solve the thorny problem of Gaza. Bit fascistic, mind, but we're not allowed to say that, so we say 'defending themselves'.

king_of_the_slums

I've been following these lot for a week or two.

They reckon Israel cannot be formed until the Jewish messiah gets here, they view the state as a forgery based on scripture.

https://twitter.com/TorahJudaism

Flaneur

Too awful to watch or read about.

I know that it's going to be the worst massacre in my lifetime. That and Srebrenica.

CharlieG

FFS.
BBC News - Steve Bell sacked by Guardian in antisemitism row over Netanyahu cartoon
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-67122609

90Piesanhour

CharlieG Just read that. Ridiculous.

Misura

CharlieG https://www.varsity.co.uk/news/26285

“We do not believe that it is in anyone’s interest for the event to go ahead. The Society would would never seek to give a platform to individuals linked with antisemitism.”

Anchor

BBC admit misleading the public over biased pro Palestinian demonstrations reporting.

cordshoes

When the inherently bullying US is being seen as the voice of reason compared to the actions of another nation state, it is indeed worrying times.

Travis_Bickle

cordshoes or when compared to the actions of a terrorist administration

cordshoes

Travis_Bickle i thought the wording nation state made it very clear.
Terrorists by nature are not expected to adhere to the same level of moral acquivalence as a nation state, or even compared to official legitimate political parties within that country.
We have learnt this from Ireland - Sinn Fein - IRA (in all it's guises).

Israel have the military might and intelligence to act better and win this war in a professional manner, with the moral high ground still achieved by them.

doggybag

Israel haven't pushed across their border yet maybe because Biden is on his way. He might get the Israelis to stand down or it might just be a pause till Joe gets up to 35,000 feet and out of there.
But that's Hamas out there; they ain't moving. So it's probably wishful thinking after all.

Travis_Bickle

doggybag I suspect they're waiting to get everything in place in the North ready for any Hezbollah offensive.

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