Israel

90Piesanhour

YoungParisian_inExile

Epstein worked for Mossad.
A certain government has all the info in those files .
US bombs Iran

Misura

YoungParisian_inExile ...and if I was in the intelligence agencies of major European countries, I'd currently be undertaking a rapid investigation into how much they'd compromised their respective national security/governance/etc.

Reggie_Perrin

YoungParisian_inExile

Listen to this, excellent. Robert Maxwell too.

90Piesanhour

Israelis bleating about Iranian drone attacks. Suck it up you murdering bastards. He that sows the wind shall reap the whirlwind.

Djpekingman

90Piesanhour How deary me. We've murdered their children and bombed the fuck out of their cities and they are retaliating. How very dare they?!! Utter cunts.

Travis_Bickle

90Piesanhour He that sows the wind shall reap the whirlwind.

'Israel must be eradicated from the page of history'
'It is incumbent on every Muslim to arm himself against Israel'
'This degenerative tumour that has, with backing of major powers, been planted in the heart of Islamic states and whose roots daily threaten the Islamic lands must be removed with help and effort of Islamic states and the great nations of Islam'
Shame Khomeini didn't listen to you....

90Piesanhour

Bombing the fuck out of Lebanon now. I imagine they’ll be targeting all those Hezbollah fighters hiding in schools, hospitals, ambulances, children’s clothes etc.

Placid

this thread is the equivalent of watching mad people shouting at the wind

cordshoes

Is Lebanon becoming the new Gaza, and in such a casual manner?
And if the Russians are the "baddies" in one war, then who are the "baddies" between Israel and Lebanon?

YoungParisian_inExile

Israel are the good guys .. so Lebanon must be the baddies .

king_of_the_slums

Trying to keep out of this thread.

As someone who spent 2 years in the middle-east, working across the region. I found the Lebanese in particular were some of the nicest, chilled people going. Iranians, not too far behind. It's all a scam, the creation of the "bogeyman," we're told who to hate, and it's not a reflection of their citizens at large!

king_of_the_slums

Let's not even get on to the musical output coming from Lebanon!

Travis_Bickle

Hezbollah, the target of Israel's undoubted aggression, want to expel Western influence from the middle-east and destroy Israel. They are aligned with Iran's Islamist leaders and supported Assad's murderous regime in Syria's civil war.
Israel has flouted international conventions and engaged in attacks outside of its borders.
Both can make fairly solid claims to have been the baddies over the decades.
I don't think many will be surprised at my preference for a victor, but that doesn't mean that I support Netanyahu's latest attempt to shore up his own grip on power. Part of me wonders if he's worried about losing the historically solid support of the USA as Trump moves on to his next invasion and, in the longer term, the political landscape changes there. A 'land grab' while he still can perhaps?
There's a great deal to criticise in what Israel does. But I think you have to try and understand what it means to be an Israeli and, increasingly, a Jew as more move their in the face of prejudice and hate around the world. They are surrounded by some states who, at best, tolerate them and others who, in larger numbers, want to wipe them off the face of the earth. 'Always on trial for just being born' as Dylan put it.
That doesn't mean I support or condone the recent land incursion into Lebanon for example. But I can understand why some who live there think it's in their interests for their government to pursue one.

90Piesanhour

Do you denounce the genocide in Gaza, too, Trav or do you deny it happened?

CharlieG

90Piesanhour That's a bit glib and oversimplified, Pies.
Nobody on here denies the horrors that the state of Israel have purportrated but if the boot was on the other foot, the annihilation would be of a similar magnitude. My Jewish friends are, almost, terrified to go out of the house in Leeds.
It's existential on both sides.

90Piesanhour

CharlieG Not glib or over simplified at all. I abhor genocide against Jews, Kurds, Syrians, Ukrainians, etc., but am appalled at the way deaths/killings of thousands of, mainly women and children in Gaza has been questioned, denied or challenged by so many people in the media, the world and, sometimes, on here. It shouldn’t be and, if there is any justice left in the world, there will be a reckoning. What the fuck do we think is happening in Lebanon and Iran at the moment? Same shit, different countries, or am I missing something?

cordshoes

CharlieG My Jewish friends are, almost, terrified to go out of the house in Leeds.

The Jewish people I know in Broughton/Prestwich have gone from being wary to being extremely nervous.
My opinion is that it is a lot scarier for them because of the genocidal actions of Netanyahu and the Israeli government.

Travis_Bickle

Did people die who shouldn't have done? Unquestionably. Were actions taken that shouldn't have been? Again, unquestionably. Israel isn't unique in that regard.
Netanyahu placed his own citizens at greater risk through a number of the ways he prosecuted the war in Gaza. Again, he won't be the first or the last to do that.
But I don't 'denounce the genocide in Gaza' as defined in international law as I don't believe Israel's actions constituted one. I saw a suggestion that South Africa's filing at the ICC was 'narrative warfare' dressed up in judicial language. I might not have been so cutting, but I share the sentiment.

Djpekingman

90Piesanhour Same shit, same prepetrators, different countries on the receiving end.

We'll never know how many civilians are being bombed to fuck in Iran by US and Israeli forces, nor how many are being massacred in southern Lebanon. Another war crime that is going unreported.

90Piesanhour

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